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Firstly, let's get this out of the way ... GPS watches are never going to be 100% accurate ... by their nature they can't be ... so there is always some small variance.
Having said that yesterday's race measured 10.25 miles on my Garmin 620 which is much higher than I would expect and consensus yesterday was that the race was long.
The course this year was a little different from the 2015 one I last ran.
My theory on why it was possibly long, centres on the track finish.
I reckon at least 200m would've been added by coming onto the track and turning left, running ~100m before a full lap clockwise, as opposed to coming in and continuing anti-clockwise to the finish (~300m).
Anyway, I am not losing any sleep about this ;0) ... just interested in others' thoughts ... it was after all a very pleasant race with good weather ... much prefer the newer course, where you turn left after the track start and that means there is no need for the turn-back of old at ~mile-8.
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Yes, I'd agree. I think they got the distance run on the track wrong. 10.35 on my Garmin. The mile markers were out from the onset. Pretty chaotic organisation too this year.
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I think Phil measured this course, so if they've laid it out differently to the original measurement, then an explanation is needed. I stress "IF" - and would invite Phil to officially comment before you do anything.
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I heard that too Mick. It seem like the orginal course but instead of going right when you come out of the gate you went left. As for Garmines and such like why? Nothing wrong with a stop watch! I also liked the fact that they supportted the no headphone rule. Ih fact you need to be aware on this race as there were drivers who tried to knocked some of us over, including me and believe me you don't want to be running behind me when that happens as my lanuage can get abit colourful! I think there was a price increas too but I couldn't be wrong. Anyway I think it's good race particular if you are looking for castle selection as this race is hilly like some of the castle legs.
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Brecon 10 is a tad early to be a Castles Relay qualifier I'm afraid.
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I am sort of glad I am focusing on The Great South Run now. Sounds like this course was not easy but if it was also say 200m+ long, it would be a mountain to climb to get a Pb on this. It depends what you want to get out of it though of course. I can tell it was not easy looking at the times against the runners that got them. They look relatively slow to me. I love this distance and it is all relative so I might be tempted to have a go next year though. 
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Questions over the distance notwithstanding, I thought this was a good event. I didn't notice any obvious problems with the organisation, other than the pre-race briefing being somewhat on the quiet side (and probably inaudible to anyone at the back half of the start). It was a good a bit of training for the autumn halfs.
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I'm always intrigued by stories pertaining to race distance. It might interest you to know that Swansea's Phil Matthews has won this race for the last 5 consecutive years, and 7 of the last 8. His winning time was his fastest since 2011, not what you would expect for a course which is allegedly overdistance. This isn't proof either, but I'm simply sceptical about the accuracy of Garmins.
Race Winners
06 Aug 2017 53:23 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 66:25 Katie Beecher (Les Croupiers / WAL)
07 Aug 2016 54:22 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 65:10 Angharad Mair (Les Croupiers / WAL)
02 Aug 2015 54:18 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 60:14 Ellie Davies (Brecon / WAL)
03 Aug 2014 54:37 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 67:26 Niki Morgan (Chepstow / WAL)
04 Aug 2013 54:09 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 66:06 Fiona Price (Avon Valley / ENG)
05 Aug 2012 53:09 Dewi Griffiths (Swansea / WAL) 63:54 Clare Phillips (Port Talbot / WAL)
07 Aug 2011 52:13 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 64:02 Clare Phillips (Port Talbot / WAL)
01 Aug 2010 55:41 Phillip Matthews (Swansea / WAL) 65:49 Clare Phillips (Port Talbot / WAL)
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My Garmin gives 10.01M for the Castles 10. You can't get a much better match than that & I trust Phil's measurement. In previous years I've still got over distance for the Brecon 10 & I know that on at least one occasion the course was changed at the last minute. It's not just my watch either, others found the same. There will be random errors in any scientific measurement. You take an average to get the best result. However, there may be systematic errors also i.e. in distance measurement, long or short. Where is this coming from? Here's the link for more on measurement errors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observational_error |
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I do not trust GPS readings.
Measured a stretch of cycle path couple of months ago using two Garmins.
One read 10.2 other said 10.7.
Still not sure which one was correct.
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Interesting stats regarding the winners and his time relative to previous years. I was less than 30 secs off my PB which was achieved on the flatter (shorter) handicap course. Maybe its the time you make up on the first half of the race which is mostly downhill? I like the course though and its fairly well organized imo. As Matt said, you couldn't really hear the announcements at the start and the prize giving at the end was a bit strange (they gave my prize to someone else 2 years ago!). The race itself was well marshaled, plenty of water, nice scenery (very important!), etc.
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Correction on the water, they ran out (luckily it wasn't a hot day) - however a local family picked up the used bottles and offered out left over water. I thought that was nice of them to do that.
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People dont often question how the course could make a difference. Of course each course might have different Garmin levels of accuracy relative to the distance. I would expect to get a more accurate reading on a course that had less obstacles.
I think the first Km on the Cardiff Parkrun must give a very poor reading because it is tree lined which is bound to interfere. Dam important to get the first couple of km right too!
As Phil rightly says a Garmin is a training aid and you use them to judge race pace at your peril.
You should use mile markers idealy. Never got the knack myself though. A Garmin is only ever a rough guide and can on occasion be well wide of the mark.
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It will also depend on what line you run! If you don't use GPS, how else is a runner to measure distance? Edited by user 10 August 2017 15:22:23(UTC)
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Phil measured the coarse this year probably because they changed it. if that is so that would be the 3rd time since I've ever done it.
have they changed it this year to make it less hilly!! which would make everyone's times better.
for those with Gadgets have you set your gadget to take into consideration of inclines. Garmin do have a setting for this
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Originally Posted by: alan mann  Phil measured the coarse this year probably because they changed it. if that is so that would be the 3rd time since I've ever done it.
have they changed it this year to make it less hilly!! which would make everyone's times better.
for those with Gadgets have you set your gadget to take into consideration of inclines. Garmin do have a setting for this I just guestimate inclines and tag a bit on, or better still avoid hilly courses! 
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Alan has a point about inclines. A discussion last night also brought up a point about starting Garmins when the start gun goes. Many people would still be well before the official start line & thus run further. |
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Some interesting feedback. Thanks. Would be good to get an answer from the main man ... a pic of the measured route please. 😀
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